Gerhard Berger celebrates his 65th birthday: find our carpool with the Austrian pilot

(interview taken from AH n°2172, July 4, 2018)

Gerhard, why do you use the services of a driver? Don't want to drive anymore?

I still travel a lot, even if it's no longer long distances like in the days of F1. Through my activities in DTM, but also for the needs of my company (Berger Logistik GmbH. Editor's note), I often go to Germany, Austria, Italy, Monaco and I ended up understanding that a minivan with a driver is the most comfortable way to get from point A to point B. I spend my phone calls, I work on my files, I also sleep, in short I use this travel time rather than wasting it. Sometimes I even prefer the minivan to my office to work, because I am not disturbed every five minutes.

Isn't it too stressful for your driver to drive a Grand Prix winner?

Josef has worked for me for 25 years, and nothing scares him anymore. He's only grumpy when he can't immediately find the destination on the GPS or when I complain because he's driving too fast!

Our starting point today is the G'Schlössl Murtal Hotel, where you are staying during the Austrian Grand Prix, and our destination the Red Bull Ring. What does this circuit represent for you?

This is where I started my career. Every time I come here, I think of that day in 1979 when I took part in my very first race on this circuit which still bore the name Zeltweg. I like this place. Sometimes I even think it would be nice to live here, even if it's in the middle of nowhere.

Was motorsport something we talked about in the family circle when you were a teenager?

My family ran a transport company and I grew up around trucks and engines, but nothing to do with motorsport. In fact, I was more into motorcycles, then I bought this Alfasud. It went from there.

It was also in Zeltweg that you competed in your first Grand Prix…

Yes, in 1984, on ATS! It's also where I won my very first race, long before F1. My career, my very life, are closely linked to this circuit.

You are the only driver to have competed in a Grand Prix on the legendary Osterreichring and on the A1-Ring today called Red Bull Ring. Verdict?

The old route was a monument! We arrived at the Bosch curve with our feet inside. There were no clearances, just the rails to accommodate you. Everything was on the limit, including the neck muscles. This track had so much more character than the new one. We have gained in security what we have lost in pleasure.

Looking back on your long career in F1, which period means the most to you?

The 1986 and 1987 seasons. I was very young and I was still getting my bearings. I had competed in a few Grands Prix in 1984 with ATS, then the 1985 season with Arrows and I was only beginning to understand F1. The cars were fantastic, with no power limitation, with 1350 hp in qualifying. We've never been so powerful. This was F1 at its best, the essence of the sport.

Senna was more than a teammate for you. Did Imola 1994 change your view of motorsport?

Another Imola had done it before, in 1989, when I went out in Tamburello. A big crash (San Marino Grand Prix on Ferrari. Editor’s note) which pushed me to better manage my risk-taking. After Ayrton's accident, I wondered if it wasn't the right time to stop, but I couldn't see myself doing anything else. He was my friend, I was devastated, but I thought we accepted all the risks. Even today, we talk a lot about Ayrton, but there are so many who also paid for their passion with their lives.

When you became director of BMW Motorsport in 1998, did you have to reprogram your brain?

Yes and no! It wasn't that difficult because having grown up in the family business, I had this experience of the staff, the decisions to be made, etc. Also, bringing all this experience acquired on the other side of the wall was an advantage. The difficulty for me, the new thing, was to evolve in the environment of a large manufacturer. Imposing structures, cumbersome decision-making processes… I was more in a commando spirit.

Under your leadership, BMW wins 24 Hours of Le Mans in 1999 and returned to F1 as an engine manufacturer in 2000. Why, then, not have supported the takeover of Sauber?

My first project was Le Mans, and there were a certain number of people in the company who expected it to fail because, according to them, I did not have the required university education. Only, thanks to Williams who had produced an excellent chassis and at the Schnitzer team, we won and I found myself in a strong position. We made the F1 engine and signed with Williams. Our V10 was excellent, but I started to doubt because the symbiosis was not perfect with the team. Adrian Newey had left, and there were certain cultural differences between Germany and England that made it not work. I told the board that if we wanted to be world champions, we had to have our team. The response was first positive, then negative when a new CEO arrived. I didn't want to stay as an engine engineer, and as my 5-year contract was coming to an end, I left. Two years later, Mario Theissen put the file back on the table and it was accepted.

Three years later, however, you are back in F1, as co-owner of Toro Rosso and Team Principal…

I loved it! Dietrich Mateschitz, whom I knew even before the birth of Red Bull, called me one day to tell me that he had just acquired Minardi and that he would like us to acquire a 50% stake. I think that with Franz (Tost. Editor’s note), we did a good job – with the victory of Sebastian Vettel at Monza in 2008. It worked because our concept was based on what Ferrari is now doing with Haas. It was the only solution to keep the budget low. It was unfortunately decided that each stable had to do everything by itself; which I considered impossible. In this scenario, Red Bull was going to pay for everything because I couldn't see myself finding the necessary money. I told Didi (nickname Mateschitz. Editor's note) that it was better if he did everything alone, since in the end he was going to sign all the checks...

During your career, you have rubbed shoulders with real characters like Enzo Ferrari, Ron Dennis, Bernie Ecclestone and others. Is the current F1 lacking in charismatic characters?

All the ills of this sport come from the fact that it is now dependent on resources and budgets that only the big manufacturers can support. This system repels companies like Mécachrome, Cosworth and others who would do a good job. Next to it, there is Red Bull – the only big company that can keep up – and the others who are caught by the throat. Everything is just “corporate” now, and there is no more room for Frank Williams, Ron Dennis, Ken Tyrrell, Guy Ligier… and a Bernie whose way of managing the barnum made you, the journalists , had great stories to tell. Stories of men, not kindergarten!

Speaking of personalities, how do you explain that a small country like Austria has produced so many iconic F1 figures like you, Niki Lauda, Toto wolff, Helmut Marko, Franz Tost, Dietrich Mateschitz?

It all started with the exploits of Jochen Rindt and the comments of the journalist and commentator Heinz Prüller who knew how to convey the emotions. After Rindt's death, Helmut Marko arrived. He was about to join Scuderia Ferrari when he had his accident at Charade (1972 French Grand Prix where gravel punctured his eye. Editor’s note). Then came Niki who would become one of the sacred monsters of the discipline. I arrived after and kept the momentum going. I met Didi Mateschitz who decided to make motorsport her promotional platform…

How did you get to know him?

Right here, in 1985, while I was flying for Arrows. One day, a guy shows up in front of me and introduces himself: “ Hello, I'm Mr. Mateschitz and I would like to sponsor you! » I'm broke and I tell myself that this guy is a gift from heaven until he explains to me that he doesn't have the money yet. I'm about to turn away when he begs me to let him finish and tells me he has no money, but an idea! He talks to me about his drink, tells me that he's going to create his company, and I tell myself that this guy is definitely crazy. As he is nevertheless friendly to me, I take him to the Schönberg restaurant at the top of the circuit for a beer. He asks me again if we can do something together, and I tell him again that it's useless since he has no money. Finally, seduced by the character, I accept a deal for 7000 dollars in exchange for a small slot on my helmet if, by chance, he manages to create his brand. We separate. The weeks pass and two months later, he calls me, asks me if I remember him and tells me that he has just created his brand, Red Bull, that very day. He asks me if the market is still holding. I answer yes. I receive the sticker and place it on my helmet. The 1986 Brazilian Grand Prix arrives where I have to jog for the purposes of a story produced by Austrian television. To help the guy, after running, I grab a can of Red Bull and drink. Two days later he calls me to thank me because people go to gas stations to find his drink. We haven't left each other since.

Close, you are also to the members of McLaren. How do you judge the situation at the stable?

I remained very close to Mansour Ojjeh, I know Mohamed very well (Bin Isa Al Khalifa. Editor's note), I have a lot of friends in Woking. It's a little painful for me to see what's happening and to think that based on my experience, things aren't going to work out that way. Maybe I'm wrong, but at the moment, progress is slow in coming. It's none of my business, but things are starting to get very complicated.

And with Ferrari, have you remained close as well?

I was extremely close to the Scuderia for years, very close to Luca (Di Montezemolo. Editor’s note), by Piero (Lardi Ferrari. Editor’s note), by Jean Todt when he was still in the walls. When I left F1, they were always there for me. I felt at home in Maranello, it was my family. Today, with the new generation in place, things are different. I don't even go for a coffee at the motorhome anymore, because I don't feel welcome. It makes me a little sad.

Too expensive, too technological, too far from its fans, does F1 also make you a little sad?

It is always difficult to give an opinion, because there are so many parameters that escape you when you are outside. There is politics, the pressure to make a decision, what the fans want, what the manufacturers want... What I can only say is that I regret that F1 is now managed by the system and no longer by experts. As long as this system is not changed, I do not see any possible evolution.

Could the 2021 regulations be the answer?

Ross Brawn understands sports. He is the man for the job, but does he really have the ability to follow through on his ideas? I doubt it. What I see at the moment are actions aimed at diverting attention such as the ban on grid girls, the ban on changing the color of one's helmet more than once per season, etc. During this At that time, we fall asleep in front of our TV. Liberty Media is increasing its efforts to make the sport attractive, but if the spectacle on the track is not good, it is of no use. Honestly, I'm surprised there are still so many fans.

The aging of fans is also a problem…

I have very good relations with Jean Todt. He's a friend. I know how hard he works, but I don't agree that the FIA ​​must meet all needs. We must be “hybrid” because the world demands it, we must be this and that… I think we have to keep it simple. What do fans want? Races where the small team can occasionally dethrone the big one. Where ingenuity can overcome the biggest budgets. Where pilots control real mechanical monsters. It's more important than an MGU-K, MGU-H or whatever.

Do you have the same problems in DTM?

The situation has become complicated in DTM, simply because Mercedes decided to withdraw. I accepted the presidency because the three manufacturers involved (Mercedes, BMW and Audi. Editor's note) had committed to three years. And then three months later, Mercedes left. It's a bit of a headache at the moment.

We arrive at the Red Bull Ring, the end of our journey. Any last words?

Yes, just to say that I would love to start all over again, to go back to the day I first arrived here, but with the experience that I have today.

Comments collected by Jean-Michel Desnoues